人物訪談

1、可以和讀者們分享一下您在學習建筑學方面的經(jīng)驗嗎？有沒有什么事情給您留下深刻印象？

因為我們倆都在各自的大學教建筑學，所以比較容易回想多年以前自己的學習情況。大學時期是一個探索發(fā)現(xiàn)的時期。幸運的是，我們的導師都比較有影響力。是他們激發(fā)我們對建筑學的興趣，幫助并引導我們進行探索。

作為80年代初期的建筑系學生，我們不斷地探索如何超越當時盛行的現(xiàn)代主義模式，明確建筑學的真正價值。然而實際上，我們更渴望在現(xiàn)實生活中去摸索和實踐。所以，畢業(yè)后我們就立即成立了自己的公司。但現(xiàn)實讓我們清醒地意識到，自己還有更多需要學習的東西。

2、自1986年創(chuàng)立Kimmel-Eshkolot Architects建筑事務(wù)所以來，已經(jīng)有30多年了。能否和讀者們分享您是如何保持對建筑設(shè)計的熱情的？

最開始的時候，我們設(shè)計了一個很小的餐廳，后來承接的項目越來越大，獲得的收益也日漸客觀。于是事務(wù)所的規(guī)模開始逐漸擴大。雖然我們接到的任務(wù)越來越有難度，卻也覺得非常有趣，樂在其中。

我們始終盡可能地讓設(shè)計作品多樣化，不局限于某些特定領(lǐng)域。這樣我們可以涉及從室內(nèi)設(shè)計到城市規(guī)劃整個建筑領(lǐng)域的各種規(guī)模和類型的項目。我們相信，這樣廣泛涉獵，不固步自封，可以使我們保持一種敏銳性，不斷豐富作品成果。

3、您是如何開始一個項目的設(shè)計的？一般設(shè)計理念源于哪里，是如何形成的呢？

好的設(shè)計可能有多種來源。設(shè)計的靈感可以來源于其地點——建筑所在地。

在建筑所在地尋找可能的啟發(fā)（就像我們經(jīng)常打比方說，建筑已經(jīng)在那了，建筑師要做的就是發(fā)現(xiàn)它），認真分析周邊的格局、地勢、氣候、以及城市和物理環(huán)境，充分發(fā)掘能夠與設(shè)計項目相關(guān)聯(lián)的因素。

另外，也可以從設(shè)計的需求入手，也就是明確建筑的功能——為什么建造這個項目。

深入了解設(shè)計項目的需求，是要建造一個實體的、精神的、還是象征性的建筑。要明確建筑的使用人群，及其與建筑功能之間的關(guān)系……

實踐中，我們還發(fā)現(xiàn)了另一個途徑——如何構(gòu)建建筑。

我們該如何構(gòu)建這個項目，建筑的構(gòu)造應該是怎樣的，可以采用哪些技術(shù)。如何讓構(gòu)建方法融入建筑理念，如何保證所選用的技術(shù)不僅僅可以支持建筑理念，更源自于建筑理念。

4、作為一家以色列公司，您大部分作品都在以色列，那么當?shù)氐奈幕蜌夂驅(qū)δ脑O(shè)計有什么樣的影響？

我們一直注重項目與其背景之間的聯(lián)系，包括地點、氣候、物理環(huán)境、城市環(huán)境和文化背景。我們所有的項目都是室內(nèi)和室外空間的融合或組合，具有雙重功能。另一方面，我們追求建筑的通用品質(zhì)，例如：符合人類需求，具備空間移動性，完善照明質(zhì)量等。

5、您在以色列完成了很多設(shè)計項目。關(guān)于建筑與不同城市環(huán)境的融合，您有哪些經(jīng)驗和想法可以和我們分享？

每座城市都會形成自己的獨特環(huán)境，我們需要根據(jù)建筑所在環(huán)境去進行設(shè)計。比如位于Beer Sheva市工業(yè)郊區(qū)的“Beit Halochem”康復中心，就設(shè)計為一個內(nèi)向型建筑，進而形成自己的空間。而Tel Aviv市的Gallery Forum則設(shè)計為外向型建筑，以更好地融入周邊的城市環(huán)境。

6、您主要是側(cè)重于建筑設(shè)計，那么對于大規(guī)模城市設(shè)計，您的工作原則是什么？您理想中的規(guī)模是多大？

多年來，我們越來越重視城市規(guī)劃與設(shè)計的意義。因為城市規(guī)劃與設(shè)計在很多方面影響著我們的生活，是決定一個城市品質(zhì)的根本要素。比構(gòu)成城市基礎(chǔ)的建筑更為重要。也正因為如此，我們發(fā)現(xiàn)城市設(shè)計的規(guī)模是工作中重要且值得研究的一點。

工作中，我們研究如何實現(xiàn)不同的城市開發(fā)強度，如何將城市中各個方面（包括時間方面）整合到我們的城市項目中。

7、“Rishon LeZion城市大道”項目榮獲2014年一等獎。這是您與荷蘭建筑師和都市學家Hans Davidson的合作項目。能和我們分享一下您此次合作的經(jīng)驗嗎？

此次與荷蘭城市規(guī)劃專家Hans Davidson（已故）的合作很成功，項目耗費的時間也很長。我們在以色列3個重要的城市競賽中勝出，其中一個獲獎作品是耶路撒冷政府宿舍。Hans專注于研究城市規(guī)模，對我們的設(shè)計給予了很大幫助。

8、20世紀80年代您對Neve Tzedek進行了翻新和保護，是什么促使您進行這個項目的呢？

1986年我們大學畢業(yè)（海法理工學院）的時候，正是以色列經(jīng)濟蕭條最嚴重的時期。建筑師幾乎接不到任何項目，我們只能自己找出路。Neve Tzedek是Tel Aviv市一個破舊的老街區(qū)，住在那里的居民能搬走的都搬走了。但我們認為老街區(qū)有著獨特的魅力和巨大的潛力。因此，我們找到留在那里的五戶人家，跟他們說了自己的計劃，然后說服他們和我們一起把這塊地買下來，由我們進行設(shè)計。這一項目標志著這一老街區(qū)高檔化的開始。

事實證明這是一個明智的決定。Neve Tzedek越來越多的人找到我們。隨著業(yè)務(wù)的擴展，我們有了資金，成立了自己的公司。幾年后，我們負責設(shè)計了當?shù)氐纳鐓^(qū)中心。Neve Tzedek變成了Tel Aviv市的時尚區(qū)，很受歡迎。我們也留在那里生活和工作。

9、能否和我們的讀者分享一下您從事這個行業(yè)以來最具挑戰(zhàn)性的項目？

毫無疑問，最具挑戰(zhàn)性的項目肯定是Har Herzl Memorial紀念館，因為當時在政府事務(wù)方面遇到了很大的阻力。那是一個漫長的過程，我們要與很多委員會溝通，以征得各方的理解和同意。對我們來說，進行一個各層面都成功的項目非常重要，從個人到社會，從普通到深刻。

10、您如何看待中國當代建筑？如果有機會，你想設(shè)計什么樣的項目？

我們對中國的當代建筑很感興趣，它帶給我們一種新鮮感，體現(xiàn)出中國偉大的文化和精神底蘊。如果有機會，我們將很樂意設(shè)計文化和教育項目以及城市規(guī)劃項目。

11、您認為建筑領(lǐng)域有哪些發(fā)展趨勢和方向？

參數(shù)化設(shè)計將成為主導。無論是建筑設(shè)計還是城市規(guī)劃，計算機都將成為關(guān)鍵。隨著高度復雜的三維“繪圖表”技術(shù)的發(fā)展，計算機無疑成了不可或缺的設(shè)計工具。 關(guān)于這一領(lǐng)域未來的發(fā)展方向，我認為是尋找能夠優(yōu)化建筑方案的算法，或者尋找可以幫助我們應對城市設(shè)計復雜性的算法。

1. Would you like to share with our readers your experiences in learning architecture? Is there anything that impressed you most?

Since we both teach architecture in various universities - we always can refiect to our own learning experience many years ago.Those years were a period of discovery. Luckily, we had some infiuential tutors that inspired us and helped us to steer our passion for architecture.

Being an architecture student in the early eighties – we were very busy exploring how to reach beyond the modernistic paradigm that ruled the profession and it’s sober functionality.However, we were eager to explore the profession in real life so immediately after graduating we have started our ownfirm just tofind out that we have so much more to learn.

2. It's been over 30 years since you founded Kimmel-Eshkolot Architects in 1986. Could you share with our readers how you have maintained the great passion for architectural design?

The office gradually grew with projects starting from a design of a very small restaurant and slowly getting bigger and bigger commissions, we enjoyed the process of receiving more complex and interesting projects with the time.We always kept the variety of projects, never confining ourselves to specificfields, this way we can enjoy the different scales and types of projects in the full spectrum of architecture from interior design to urban planning.We believe that by doing so we also keep a certain sensitivity that enriches the projects, as knowledge and informationfioat between the scales.

3. How do you start the design of a project?And how the design concepts are activated and generated?

There are many possible generators for good architecture. The way that can lead to the design could start from the site – the WHERE

Discovering what are the hints coming from the site (following the well-known paraphrase that the project is already there and the architect only has tofind it..) carefully analyzing the site, the landscape, the topography, the climate,the urban and physical context and understanding the possible connections to and from the project- this will generate the design.

But one can choose a route that derives from understanding the need for this project, its functions – the WHY

A deep understanding of what is the reason for this project - whether it’s a physical need or a spiritual or symbolic one, it’s to understand who this project is for, what is the relationship between the functions…

But we alwaysfind another interesting route in our design process and that is- the HOW

How should we build this project, what is the tectonic of the building, its technology, how can wefind a building method that is a part of the architectural idea, a technology that comes not only to serve the idea but to be part of it .

4. As an Israel-based firm, you carry out most of your designs in Israel. How would the regional culture and climate affect and influence yourdesign?

We strongly believe in connecting the project to its context whether it is the site, the climate, the physical or urban context and the cultural context.We see all our projects as compounds or assemblies of interior and exterior spaces– functioning together.On the other hand we search for the universal qualities of architecture, Such as the human scale, the motion in space and quality of light, etc.

5. You accomplished a lot of projects in Israel. What experience and ideas do you have for integrating architecture into different urban environments?

Urban context varies - There are projects such as the rehabilitation center "Beit Halochem" in Beer Sheva which is situated in an industrial suburb of the city – thus generating a more introverted project- so as to create its own surrounding were on the other hand our Gallery Forum in Tel Aviv is a very extrovert building celebrating the urban life around it.

6. Your projects mainly focus on architectural design. What is your working principles for a larger scale urban design? What is the ideal scale for you?

With the years we tend to better understand the importance of thefield of urban planning and design. It is effecting our lives in so many ways, and in the end it is the urban quality that will define the city’s quality, much more than the architectural qualities of the buildings that create the urban setting. This is the reason that wefind the scale of urban design so interesting and important, to work with.

In our work, we research how to create different urban intensities, and how to overlap all the layers of a city including the layers of time into our urban projects.

7. The project "Rishon LeZion Urban Avenue"won the first prize in 2014. And you cooperated with Hans Davidson, the Netherland architect and urbanologist. Can you share the feeling of this cooperation experience?

Our collaboration with the (late) Dutch urbanist Hans Davidson was a successful collaboration taking place for a long period of time. We have won together 3 important urban competitions in Israel including the design of the government quarters in Jerusalem. Specializing in the urban scale Hans certainly contributed depth to our urban solutions.

8. What prompted your interest in the renovation and conservation of Neve Tzedek in the 1980s?

1986 the year we came out of the university (the Technion in Haifa) was the peak of a financial recession in Israel with absolutely no work for architects, so we had to invent our own path, Neve Tzedek was a rundown old neighborhood of Tel Aviv abandoned by whoever could leave this area, but we found it charming and full of potential, this is why we have gathered a group of 5 families, made some sketches for a vacant site and convinced them to buy the land together with us, and let us be the architects, It was thefirst project that marked the gentrification of this neighborhood.

It turned out to be a fantastic decision – and we started to get more and more small commissions in Neve Tzedek that helped us to establish ourfirm and after a few years to design the community center of the area. Neve Tzedek became a very fashionable desired area in Tel Aviv and we live and work there ever since.

9. Would you like to share with our readers the most challenging project since you took up the profession?

Undoubtedly the Har Herzl Memorial, being a project that deals with painful issues on the national level. It was a long process, where we had to meet many committees and build up a broad understanding and consent. It was important for us to have a project that’s interpretable on many different levels, from the personal to the social, and from the prosaic to the abstract.

10. What do you think the contemporary architecture in China? If you have a chance, what kind of project you’d like to design?

We are fascinated with contemporary architecture in China when it brings out something new and fresh, with local infiuence of the great Chinese culture and spirit. We would love to design projects of culture and education programs, as well as urban planning.

11. What do you think the trend and development direction of the future architecture?

Parametric design is the future– both in architecture and in urban planning, the computers arefinely becoming this amazing tool from the stage of being a highly sophisticated 3 dimensional "drawing table" they become a true tool of the design work. Finding algorithms to optimize an architectural solution or even morefinding the algorithms that could help us to master the complexity of urban design is what we see as the future of our wonderful profession.